SharkyUK

I have never been moved to write a forum post before, but I feel now is the time to express my growing disillusionment with the FM franchise. I'm not sure if it's just me, but I think the FM series gets worse with every new iteration. Don't get me wrong, I like all the improvements and tweaks they have made to the series, I just feel with the relentless pursuit for 'realism' they have sucked all the life and fun out of the game. With previous versions, you could find a tactic for your chosen team and in certain cases, it was the only tactic you would ever need, apart from a little tweaking whenever the AI cracked it. These days, there are so many variables that the whole thing just seems random and inconsistent. I dont think this is true to life. Look at Man U, Arsenal or Chelsea. They all play pretty much the same formation week in and week out. Why? Because it's one thing knowing how Man U or Arsenal play and another to actually be good enough to stop them. That's what is so frustrating about FM now. I can patiently assemble a team of world beaters and then watch indifferent results kill my team all because there is no one universal 'super tactic' anymore, meaning I have to keep faffing about with tactics like some sort of deranged Ranieri. Basically, I am just getting hacked off with seemingly random results and performances and not being allowed to have my team play the way I want, the way that I could with previous incarnations. Kinda makes me want to go back and dig out the old CM titles. They might not have the graphical polish or myriad of options but in my opinion they are infinitely more playable and enjoyable. After all, it's a game. And games are meant to be fun, so if that means realism is sacrificed for enjoyment, well thats a trade off I would rather see. Sorry for the long post, just wondered if anyone feels the way I do.

fozzafulham

cant be bothered to read all that but the game isnt jsut about tatics its about what you say to your players the pre match media interviews etc

Hartynips

Yeah but where's the fun in a "super tactic"? Surely its about analysing the scout reports you get on the upcoming team you will play, Then picking a team you think can deal with what the opposition has to offer?

Maybe you need to think about varying the styles you play with, in order to get more from the game. If you just play one tactic then sit back and expect results to come flooding your way, then you arent a manager of a side at all, your just supervising?

SharkyUK

OK fair point but I ask this question. Do you think Arsene Wenger or Alex Ferguson change their tactics much, if at all? I dont think so. Man Utd always play attacking, possession football, as do Arsenal, whether they are at home or away. That's because football is not so much about the tactics (most teams play 4 4 2 or a variation on that theme). The real crux of the matter is the psychology and motivation. I think SI are getting there in terms of the motivation side of things but I think they have made the tactics engine too random, and in my opinion its a major step back from older versions and the main reason why FM frustrates rathr than entertains me these days.

Hartynips

Good managers like Mourinho, Ferguson, Wenger ect will still change their tactics to cope with whoever they play against. Tactics used against Liverpool for instance will differ very much from tactics against say, fulham or birmingham. Granted the players on the pitch are the same players but they will have different instructions. Also, most teams they play against have to look how to cope with the likes of Rooney, Adebayour and Ronaldo, so thats a contributing factor.

Rafa Benitez is a class example of somebody who has a great squad, with a lot of tactical naivety. This can be construed also onto FM, as if you go out with an all attacking formation against the likes of Man Utd, you will most likely get caught out. However, if you do the same against Birmingham on FM, you will dominate the game and still get caught out. In my opinion, try to keep similar formations, and vary attacking or defending styles, to keep the AI on its toes.

Wednesdayboy

Its not random results its just the game being a bit more realistic, If there was one super tactic in football IRL then everyone would play that tactic and as has been proven, they don't, the point of managing is you find a tactic that brings the best out of your team, and know how to edit it slightly so your team can counter over teams tactics like RL managers.

Akenatwn

I agree with Harty.If there's a super tactic and you beat everybody,then firstly this isn't fun at all and second this isn't a Manager game.Tactics is an integral part of being a manager.Yes, a RL manager may not change their formation much,but there's more to tactics than formation.Ferguson would give completely different instructions to his players when playing against Arsenal than when playing against Derby.And exactly that's the meaning of tactics.After all that's FM.You choose a formation,build a team around it and play each game by giving the appropriate instuctions.
And about the randomness,isn't that why we love football?If you remove the random aspect from the game,then this isn't about football anymore,it's about Numbers and Statistics.
For me the newer versions are as much fun as the old ones.The only bad thing in the current version is that it is too easy.

Toumba...Don't you just love it?


Villans Fan For Ever

mlp071

Mmmm, there is 4 major flaws in 8.0.2 ME (stated by one of the ME designers ) that people are abusing or can abuse:

* The corner routine
* Crazy arrows
* Arrowed AMC to FC
* Narrow midfield with 2 MCs in front of DMC, which renders the opposing wingers and FBs defensively redundant

So "super tactics" of likes of Diablo are more possible in 08 then they were in 07, and people are using them(Tzas tactic is supposedly one of them that uses engine flaws)

- Plus issues with DM getting to many yellow and red cards in game and low match ratings.

- Then you have Registration bug , Confidence bug (both confirmed as still not fixed after 8.0.2 by SI)

And some more random minor bugs, that may show up or not from game to game(g. missing season fixtures..)


I went back to 07, because i didn't know anymore was my teams wining because i did something good or it's another flaw that i don't know about that helped me.

I wouldn't say that state of game is good in 08, but rather catastrophic imho.

Fedorico Roma Fan

well what a great discussion ;)

this is one subject that splits FM fans everywhere, is FM turning into more of a manager simulation than just a game? i think that it is slowly which will in the long-run make it much harder and much less-enjoyable. For now im happy with changing my tactic ever 4/5 months to stop going on a bad run.

I would turn my back on the game if it became too easy and there was a super tactic available that you would win every game, surely that would take away the realism that we all love about the game?

tartantroosers

I'm getting constantly frustrated with FM 08, and yet thats what keeps drawing me back to it - to change tactics, to try different players in different positions etc. - very frustrating when you go on a bad run it doesn't seem to matter what you try, to really enjoyable when you do get it right - which I presume what real fm is all about

Hartynips

In my Hull City game (season 2) I have just ran with a tactic TH lent me for 2-3 games and drew v Fulham, lost against west ham and got knocked out of the cup v Bolton. This was having used it successfully for about 5-6 games beforehand. Out of desperation I returned to another tactic, "wozzas widge" (Free plug thats another fiver) for a game against Man Utd purely to just try and grab a much needed point.

Result? Dominated the game completely against a full strength Utd team, won 3-2 were leading the game 3-1 for 84 frantic minutes, and in reality should have scored at least 6.

Can only assume Ferguson was very confident that his R+R partnership, unbeaten in the league in 4 games was going to hammer me. Way wrong answer Fergie! This I feel is the magic of FM, and I love it.